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	<title>Comments on: Pistols Make for Picnic in the Park</title>
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	<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/</link>
	<description>it&#039;s like being there</description>
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		<title>By: mike</title>
		<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/comment-page-1/#comment-10995</link>
		<dc:creator>mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Feb 2009 04:41:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annarborchronicle.com/?p=5734#comment-10995</guid>
		<description>Is it legal to open carry in a county park?Here&#039;s what their website says.Is it legal or not
5. FIREARMS AND OTHER WEAPONS- No person shall possess or control any rifle, shotgun or other firearm, bow and arrow, slingshot, pellet gun, air rifle, fireworks, explosives, or other dangerous substances within the boundaries of any park, without written permission of the Authority; provided, that this rule shall not apply to any law enforcement officer who has been duly appointed by the government of the United States, the State of Michigan or any county, municipality other political subdivision of the State of Michigan; and provided, further that this section shall not prohibit a person from legally carrying firearms in accordance with state law, including transporting an unloaded shotgun in a case within the boundaries of Lake Erie or Metro Beach Metropark for the purpose of using Lake Erie or Metro Beach Metropark as access to a permitted hunting area.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is it legal to open carry in a county park?Here&#8217;s what their website says.Is it legal or not<br />
5. FIREARMS AND OTHER WEAPONS- No person shall possess or control any rifle, shotgun or other firearm, bow and arrow, slingshot, pellet gun, air rifle, fireworks, explosives, or other dangerous substances within the boundaries of any park, without written permission of the Authority; provided, that this rule shall not apply to any law enforcement officer who has been duly appointed by the government of the United States, the State of Michigan or any county, municipality other political subdivision of the State of Michigan; and provided, further that this section shall not prohibit a person from legally carrying firearms in accordance with state law, including transporting an unloaded shotgun in a case within the boundaries of Lake Erie or Metro Beach Metropark for the purpose of using Lake Erie or Metro Beach Metropark as access to a permitted hunting area.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Bean</title>
		<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/comment-page-1/#comment-503</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Bean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 19:13:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annarborchronicle.com/?p=5734#comment-503</guid>
		<description>You mean like how Harry did at his imagined &quot;crowd&quot;? :-)

I appreciate Dave&#039;s coverage of this, too, plus the mostly thoughtful discussion.

Wouldn&#039;t it be great to work through these kinds of wedge issues once and for all so that we can shift our attention to universal problems and ways to address them?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You mean like how Harry did at his imagined &#8220;crowd&#8221;? :-)</p>
<p>I appreciate Dave&#8217;s coverage of this, too, plus the mostly thoughtful discussion.</p>
<p>Wouldn&#8217;t it be great to work through these kinds of wedge issues once and for all so that we can shift our attention to universal problems and ways to address them?</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Thorpe</title>
		<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/comment-page-1/#comment-502</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Thorpe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 17:38:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annarborchronicle.com/?p=5734#comment-502</guid>
		<description>Good piece and lots of interesting, thoughtful discussion. Very welcome, especially since it&#039;s a polarizing subject where people often turn off their brains and start shouting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good piece and lots of interesting, thoughtful discussion. Very welcome, especially since it&#8217;s a polarizing subject where people often turn off their brains and start shouting.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Gibson</title>
		<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/comment-page-1/#comment-492</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Gibson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 06:17:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annarborchronicle.com/?p=5734#comment-492</guid>
		<description>Everyday in this country one right or another is in jeopardy of becoming extinct. As a free people we should ban together and stop infringement upon ALL rights. You may not agree with the right I choose to exercise and I may not agree with yours. I would gladly stand with you however to defend a right you are passionate about when someone attempted to infringe upon that right. Like i always say &quot;joke&#039;s over, bring back the constitution&quot;.

What &quot;some&quot; don&#039;t seem to understand about an open carry picnic is that it is done with education in mind. Most people don&#039;t know that in this state as well as 43 others you have the choice between open and concealed carry. ALL we did Sunday, was try to be educational without being confrontational. We didn&#039;t cram information down peoples throats. They came to US and asked for it. I will not tread on your right of free thought and free speech. Please don&#039;t tread on my right to &quot;choose&quot; not to become a victim or a statistic.

As far as the grad party is concerned......It was held on &quot;private property&quot;. As such the property owner could have asked me to leave for being uncomfortable with my choice to &quot;open carry&quot;. Had i refused to leave, I could have been jailed for trespassing. I could have easily chosen to conceal carry and no one would have ever known I was even carrying. I wanted to open carry at the party. I wanted people to ask &quot;who, what, when, where, why and how&quot;, thus furthering their own knowledge and realization, that they HAVE a choice. They don&#039;t have to keep their dirty little secret hidden.

What was left out of the above article was the fact that I DID wear an empty holster in plain view, my wife and I DID wear our open carry advocacy shirts, I DID carry several copies of that mornings Sunday paper outlining our smashing success of an educational picnic just 24 hours prior to the grad party. NO i was NOT scared and needed to carry to make myself feel better....I would rather attend and celebrate with my young cousin whom just reached a milestone in her life, than show up and be asked to leave since some of the guests MIGHT be nervous. Not ALL attendees were from the same family that taught me to embrace, hunting, fishing, the great outdoors and responsible gun ownership. By the end of the day most of the people there, after being educated on their rights as well as mine, were VERY upset that my rights WERE infringed upon. Even our pastor! On a side note, after some discussion, there were FIVE concealed carriers in attendance at this SAME party! 

What &quot;some&quot; of you don&#039;t realize is that it IS your doctor, neighbor, teacher, child&#039;s school bus driver and pastor that have concealed weapons. I guess...because you don&#039;t see them carrying it, that makes it ok?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Everyday in this country one right or another is in jeopardy of becoming extinct. As a free people we should ban together and stop infringement upon ALL rights. You may not agree with the right I choose to exercise and I may not agree with yours. I would gladly stand with you however to defend a right you are passionate about when someone attempted to infringe upon that right. Like i always say &#8220;joke&#8217;s over, bring back the constitution&#8221;.</p>
<p>What &#8220;some&#8221; don&#8217;t seem to understand about an open carry picnic is that it is done with education in mind. Most people don&#8217;t know that in this state as well as 43 others you have the choice between open and concealed carry. ALL we did Sunday, was try to be educational without being confrontational. We didn&#8217;t cram information down peoples throats. They came to US and asked for it. I will not tread on your right of free thought and free speech. Please don&#8217;t tread on my right to &#8220;choose&#8221; not to become a victim or a statistic.</p>
<p>As far as the grad party is concerned&#8230;&#8230;It was held on &#8220;private property&#8221;. As such the property owner could have asked me to leave for being uncomfortable with my choice to &#8220;open carry&#8221;. Had i refused to leave, I could have been jailed for trespassing. I could have easily chosen to conceal carry and no one would have ever known I was even carrying. I wanted to open carry at the party. I wanted people to ask &#8220;who, what, when, where, why and how&#8221;, thus furthering their own knowledge and realization, that they HAVE a choice. They don&#8217;t have to keep their dirty little secret hidden.</p>
<p>What was left out of the above article was the fact that I DID wear an empty holster in plain view, my wife and I DID wear our open carry advocacy shirts, I DID carry several copies of that mornings Sunday paper outlining our smashing success of an educational picnic just 24 hours prior to the grad party. NO i was NOT scared and needed to carry to make myself feel better&#8230;.I would rather attend and celebrate with my young cousin whom just reached a milestone in her life, than show up and be asked to leave since some of the guests MIGHT be nervous. Not ALL attendees were from the same family that taught me to embrace, hunting, fishing, the great outdoors and responsible gun ownership. By the end of the day most of the people there, after being educated on their rights as well as mine, were VERY upset that my rights WERE infringed upon. Even our pastor! On a side note, after some discussion, there were FIVE concealed carriers in attendance at this SAME party! </p>
<p>What &#8220;some&#8221; of you don&#8217;t realize is that it IS your doctor, neighbor, teacher, child&#8217;s school bus driver and pastor that have concealed weapons. I guess&#8230;because you don&#8217;t see them carrying it, that makes it ok?</p>
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		<title>By: Jon Shapiro</title>
		<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/comment-page-1/#comment-491</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Shapiro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 03:32:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annarborchronicle.com/?p=5734#comment-491</guid>
		<description>Jason Murdey - you seem to have some issues.   

Just because you disagree with someone that makes them &quot;pathetic&quot;?

You said that &quot;gun nuts&quot; fear minorities?  You are the one who is prejudicial and furthering stereotypes of a group of people you know nothing about.


Stop being such a hypocrite.


Worry less about the motivations and actions of others and sort out whatever problems you have in your own life that are making you so bitter.

Why is is &quot;terrifying&quot; that someone would &quot;wear a gun&quot; to a family event.

I always have a sidearm.  My family and loved ones are well aware that I&#039;m armed.  It doesn&#039;t scare them. 

You seem to have all sorts of preconceived notions about people who own and carry guns. But its those who carry guns who are bigots, right?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jason Murdey &#8211; you seem to have some issues.   </p>
<p>Just because you disagree with someone that makes them &#8220;pathetic&#8221;?</p>
<p>You said that &#8220;gun nuts&#8221; fear minorities?  You are the one who is prejudicial and furthering stereotypes of a group of people you know nothing about.</p>
<p>Stop being such a hypocrite.</p>
<p>Worry less about the motivations and actions of others and sort out whatever problems you have in your own life that are making you so bitter.</p>
<p>Why is is &#8220;terrifying&#8221; that someone would &#8220;wear a gun&#8221; to a family event.</p>
<p>I always have a sidearm.  My family and loved ones are well aware that I&#8217;m armed.  It doesn&#8217;t scare them. </p>
<p>You seem to have all sorts of preconceived notions about people who own and carry guns. But its those who carry guns who are bigots, right?</p>
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		<title>By: Jon Shapiro</title>
		<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/comment-page-1/#comment-490</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Shapiro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 03:18:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annarborchronicle.com/?p=5734#comment-490</guid>
		<description>Another point I would like to make.   

If one is an atheist or agnostic, should they oppose the freedom of religion?

If one doesn&#039;t pay attention to current events, should they oppose the freedom of the press?

If one chooses not to vote, should they oppose universal suffrage rights?

If one is unable to, or chooses not to bear children, should they oppose a woman&#039;s right to chose?

Just because you chose not to own a gun, should you oppose the rights of others to own guns for recreation or personal defense? 

You can make whatever decisions you want for your own life, but I am offended when I hear people say that guns should be kept out of private individuals homes.  Such an opinion was recently printed in an editorial in the Ann Arbor News.

The Bill of Rights is just as important today as the day it was written.  Our right to bears arms has already been infringed upon. It is constantly under attack.  Those who do not own guns could care less as the liberties of others are eroded away.   

Just ask yourself how you would feel if your pet cause was constantly demonized and assaulted by those who are considered elites in the world of academia and mass media.  Who knows, you might be next.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another point I would like to make.   </p>
<p>If one is an atheist or agnostic, should they oppose the freedom of religion?</p>
<p>If one doesn&#8217;t pay attention to current events, should they oppose the freedom of the press?</p>
<p>If one chooses not to vote, should they oppose universal suffrage rights?</p>
<p>If one is unable to, or chooses not to bear children, should they oppose a woman&#8217;s right to chose?</p>
<p>Just because you chose not to own a gun, should you oppose the rights of others to own guns for recreation or personal defense? </p>
<p>You can make whatever decisions you want for your own life, but I am offended when I hear people say that guns should be kept out of private individuals homes.  Such an opinion was recently printed in an editorial in the Ann Arbor News.</p>
<p>The Bill of Rights is just as important today as the day it was written.  Our right to bears arms has already been infringed upon. It is constantly under attack.  Those who do not own guns could care less as the liberties of others are eroded away.   </p>
<p>Just ask yourself how you would feel if your pet cause was constantly demonized and assaulted by those who are considered elites in the world of academia and mass media.  Who knows, you might be next.</p>
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		<title>By: harry beck</title>
		<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/comment-page-1/#comment-489</link>
		<dc:creator>harry beck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 03:10:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annarborchronicle.com/?p=5734#comment-489</guid>
		<description>wow, what a crowd of effete urban elitists and victim culture sob sisters!  always with the small minded jealousy and hate speech.
  As a group you need to grow up and take responsibility for your own personal security and stop trying to make fun of your betters!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>wow, what a crowd of effete urban elitists and victim culture sob sisters!  always with the small minded jealousy and hate speech.<br />
  As a group you need to grow up and take responsibility for your own personal security and stop trying to make fun of your betters!</p>
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		<title>By: Jon Shapiro</title>
		<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/comment-page-1/#comment-488</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Shapiro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 02:57:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annarborchronicle.com/?p=5734#comment-488</guid>
		<description>People always fear what they do not understand.   I have lived in Ann Arbor for almost 30 years.  I have been involved in shooting sports since I was five years old and I have had a Concealed Carry Permit for three years and I lawfully carry a firearm concealed each and every day.  

I applaud those who supported the rights of all Americans to defend themselves and to bring awareness to the public at large about firearms, be it for action shooting sports or personal protection.

those who are most vociferous in regards to the suppression of Second Amendment rights are those who are the most ignorant about firearms in every respect.   They know nothing when it comes to firearm safety, design, operation and the &quot;gun-culture&quot; itself.

Carolyn McCarthy is a case in point.   She is so ignorant that she doesn&#039;t even understand the proposed legislation that she herself authored (House Resolution 1022).  For instance, in an interview, she was asked what a barrel shroud was, she had no idea what it was.  

She has no clue what it is, but yet she wants it banned?  I fail to follow such flawed logic.

I feel sorry for her, if only because her husband was murdered.  However, her husband was murdered in New York state: one of the most oppressively anti-gun states in the union, none of the anti-gun laws on the  books in New York was able to save her husband.   Her knee-jerk response?  More laws unenforceable feel-good laws which take firearms out of the hands of responsible, well trained citizens.

However, we are more pragmatic and are cogniscient of the fact that the only thing that would have saved lives on the Long Island Railway that day would have been legally armed citizens, trained in the means of lethal force and prepared to exercise it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>People always fear what they do not understand.   I have lived in Ann Arbor for almost 30 years.  I have been involved in shooting sports since I was five years old and I have had a Concealed Carry Permit for three years and I lawfully carry a firearm concealed each and every day.  </p>
<p>I applaud those who supported the rights of all Americans to defend themselves and to bring awareness to the public at large about firearms, be it for action shooting sports or personal protection.</p>
<p>those who are most vociferous in regards to the suppression of Second Amendment rights are those who are the most ignorant about firearms in every respect.   They know nothing when it comes to firearm safety, design, operation and the &#8220;gun-culture&#8221; itself.</p>
<p>Carolyn McCarthy is a case in point.   She is so ignorant that she doesn&#8217;t even understand the proposed legislation that she herself authored (House Resolution 1022).  For instance, in an interview, she was asked what a barrel shroud was, she had no idea what it was.  </p>
<p>She has no clue what it is, but yet she wants it banned?  I fail to follow such flawed logic.</p>
<p>I feel sorry for her, if only because her husband was murdered.  However, her husband was murdered in New York state: one of the most oppressively anti-gun states in the union, none of the anti-gun laws on the  books in New York was able to save her husband.   Her knee-jerk response?  More laws unenforceable feel-good laws which take firearms out of the hands of responsible, well trained citizens.</p>
<p>However, we are more pragmatic and are cogniscient of the fact that the only thing that would have saved lives on the Long Island Railway that day would have been legally armed citizens, trained in the means of lethal force and prepared to exercise it.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Murdey</title>
		<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/comment-page-1/#comment-487</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Murdey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 00:32:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annarborchronicle.com/?p=5734#comment-487</guid>
		<description>wow it sure would be terrible if a bunch of scared gun dorks dismissed my opinion I&#039;m not sure I could bear it.

And I meant &quot;terrifying&quot; in the implications for society sense, not the &quot;I need to clutch my gun for reassurance when I walk past minorities&quot; sense that most gun nuts use it</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>wow it sure would be terrible if a bunch of scared gun dorks dismissed my opinion I&#8217;m not sure I could bear it.</p>
<p>And I meant &#8220;terrifying&#8221; in the implications for society sense, not the &#8220;I need to clutch my gun for reassurance when I walk past minorities&#8221; sense that most gun nuts use it</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Bean</title>
		<link>http://annarborchronicle.com/2008/10/13/pistols-make-for-picnic-in-the-park/comment-page-1/#comment-485</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Bean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2008 20:00:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annarborchronicle.com/?p=5734#comment-485</guid>
		<description>&quot;the fact that the guy would customarily wear a gun to a family party is pretty terrifying&quot;

Hmm, now who&#039;s the &quot;pathetic&quot; one who &quot;must be pretty frightened in their day-to-day affairs&quot;? ;-)

My guess is that the family members are actually probably comfortable with guns and the kids are taught about gun safety (and how to shoot) at an early age. More likely it was the non-family guests at the graduation party who were the concern--either their comfort level or the safety issue with kids who have never seen a gun or might think it&#039;s a toy. Also, the article was quite clear that the picnic was a statement--no one indicated that they couldn&#039;t enjoy themselves without their gun. Your comment would make it easy for gun toters (is that a derogatory term?) to dismiss your opinion.

I&#039;m not advocating gun ownership or open carrying, just pointing out that it&#039;s just different as opposed to terrifying. In any case, I do agree with you, Jason, that the real issue is fear (and not guns.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;the fact that the guy would customarily wear a gun to a family party is pretty terrifying&#8221;</p>
<p>Hmm, now who&#8217;s the &#8220;pathetic&#8221; one who &#8220;must be pretty frightened in their day-to-day affairs&#8221;? ;-)</p>
<p>My guess is that the family members are actually probably comfortable with guns and the kids are taught about gun safety (and how to shoot) at an early age. More likely it was the non-family guests at the graduation party who were the concern&#8211;either their comfort level or the safety issue with kids who have never seen a gun or might think it&#8217;s a toy. Also, the article was quite clear that the picnic was a statement&#8211;no one indicated that they couldn&#8217;t enjoy themselves without their gun. Your comment would make it easy for gun toters (is that a derogatory term?) to dismiss your opinion.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not advocating gun ownership or open carrying, just pointing out that it&#8217;s just different as opposed to terrifying. In any case, I do agree with you, Jason, that the real issue is fear (and not guns.)</p>
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