Comments on: Survey: Majority Favorable on Transit Tax

By: John Floyd

John Floyd — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 05:28:12 +0000

Mr. Kulman’s idea does not need an election to implement. If people simply send the AATA a check for whatever amount public transit is worth to them (over and above the current millage), his desire for voluntary new bus contributions is met with nary a ballot in sight, nor a record kept.

Having the voluntary contribution on your property tax bill is not necessary, and contrary to the point of taxation (which is to compel payment). I suppose it could be a vehicle for reminding of/soliciting for voluntary contributions, but as a mere information item there would be no records that the city would need to collect.

Of course, their are other issues with voluntary contributions (particularly the “Free Rider” problem), but Secret Ballot ain’t one of ‘em.

By: Steve Bean

Steve Bean — Sun, 23 Feb 2014 15:54:15 +0000

“If people think AAATA is not running a business what are they doing? They are providing transportation services and options.”

I think you answered your own question accurately.

“You are really going to have to explain how a permissive or opt-out tax millage is an oxymoron.”

No, I’m not. I could say that you need to understand the definition of business, tax, etc., but you clearly don’t, and I accept that.

By: Dave Askins

Dave Askins — Sun, 23 Feb 2014 15:20:55 +0000

Re: “I don’t understand your objection about a permissive or opt-out tax millage.”

Roger, the secret ballot is not just about the act of voting, but also the preservation of secrecy after the fact. Forever. On your proposal, it would be necessary to know how an individual taxpayer voted in order to bill that taxpayer properly for their taxes owed. And for that reason, I don’t think the idea deserves any further consideration.

By: Roger Kuhlman

Roger Kuhlman — Sun, 23 Feb 2014 07:29:43 +0000

@Dave:

I don’t understand your objection about a permissive or opt-out tax millage. As with any other kind of millage it would be put to a secret ballot in which all voters in the jurisdiction could vote

By: Roger Kuhlman

Roger Kuhlman — Sun, 23 Feb 2014 07:25:55 +0000

@Steve: You are really going to have to explain how a permissive or opt-out tax millage is an oxymoron. If we have a true democracy here in Ann Arbor, the citizenry should be able to design and vote on tax millages in any way it wants. The problem I see you having with these tax millage options is that if they were in place they would show many people would opt out in the opt out system and a majority would never sign up in the permissive system.

By: Roger Kuhlman

Roger Kuhlman — Sun, 23 Feb 2014 07:06:54 +0000

Users of the bus system are only paying 25% of the direct costs of their transportation that is what is meant by subsidized public transit. That is not fair to non-users of the system that have to foot the cost plus pay for their own transportation themselves. It also indicates that AAATA is almost certainly not economically viable. Raise percent of cost paid by riders to a reasonable 75 or 80% level and bus ridership would probably dramatically collapse.

By: Roger Kuhlman

Roger Kuhlman — Sun, 23 Feb 2014 06:57:52 +0000

If people think AAATA is not running a business what are they doing? They are providing transportation services and options. Other institutions doing this same thing are businesses. Just because the government provides the transportation services does not make it not a business. Most businesses to continue operating have to make a profit or break even. Public businesses should have to meet this same criteria or else they are bound to run inefficiently and wastefully and at higher costs than is acceptable.

By: Herb

Herb — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 09:20:09 +0000

The millage increase is on the May ballot now. Expected turnout will be about 11%. Six percent of the electorate will foist a big tax increase on everybody to buy a new fleet of white dinosaur buses that no doubt will have black curtains so people cannot see how empty they are.
This is the appetizer for a feast of local government tax increases coming up. AAPS will try for countywide millage so they can squander more on “special” education. The county’s retirement funding bonding ideas would require millage increases in the range of 35%. AADL will probably try for a conference center again. Why shouldn’t the city join in the party?
If people want to stop this lunacy they will have to form anti-tax groups, get some funding and organization, and work for electoral reforms requiring minimum turnout levels to pass millages.

By: John Floyd

John Floyd — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 02:55:30 +0000

@20 Dave,

The reason that this question is push-poll is its asymmetry: while “aging baby boomers” is cited as a reason to support transit, no group (e.g., families, and those with fixed incomes) is cited as a reason to oppose the proposed millage increase.

Providing a concrete image of a sympathetic group (seniors) that might benefit from a tax increase, while not providing a sympathetic group that might be hurt by a tax increase, could be an accident. On the other hand, it could be intentional. Either way, the results of the pole are biased by this asymmetry.

If the asymmetry is intentional, it further de-legitimizes another unit of local government – and those officials associated with it.

By: Vivienne Armentrout

Vivienne Armentrout — Fri, 21 Feb 2014 19:27:06 +0000

Thank you for providing the millage information website via Twitter. http://therideyourway.org/

Here is one of the problems I have with all of this communication: it dumbs down and simplifies results to the point that the information is inaccurate. The page has a number of “facts” without reference to how they were obtained. This one was clearly from the results of the survey:

“66% of Ann Arbor’s registered voters have used public transit.”

But they do not have data to support that, since it has not been collected. Instead, they conducted a survey with a very limited sample of people (registered voters). One question was whether they or someone they knew have used public transit. This is not called out in this present article but I believe that I am correct that this is where the 66% figure is derived from.

I could point out a number of other instances of factual blurring like this, but this is not the place.